Electrical problems

[LpoolXTZ660]

Hi all! New member here and a novice at motorbike mechanics but im a quick learner! I have always been searching on this forum so I finally decided to join!

Firstly I apologise if this is posted incorrectly.

For 1 year I have been the proud owner of an XTZ 660 (with the twin headlights 1998) I believe it’s a 4MY but I don’t mind being corrected ha ha! I love the look of the bike and when its running well it’s a lil beauty and im sure that the 750 is even sweeter!

I have had loads of problems with this bike, the majority have been fixed by myself as I don’t mind having a go. Sadly tho I have been experiencing some gremlins in my electrics L im thinking its time to search for that needle in a haystack and get a replacement loom.


The bike tends to want to cut out when im at traffic lights unless I give it a lil throttle (possibly air cut off valve as it also back fires sometimes on deceleration.

I know I need to replace the stator on the bike (currently using one battery till she dies and then swapping for another fully charged battery) and have already replaced the reg. Yesterday I put the key in as normal to ‘on’ the engine struggled to start. The ignition was turned off and back on again and nothing worked (no lights, indicators, horn) but the temperature dial and the rev counter moved slightly nothing dramatic, just as tho they were getting power (I will call this primed). I started to inspect the wires I could get to easily (those that know the bike needs stripping for practically everything!) After playing with the wires I still have the same problems but now the temp and rev needle wont (prime)


Couple of questions really:

Has anyone else experienced this on their beast?


Could this be a bad ground on the bike? Its never ran perfect but it is an old lady now! Where are the grounds located for this bike? (please don’t say the frame ha!)


I was thinking it could be the CDI has gone any thoughts?


Anyone know how to get hold of a wiring loom (or have this one repaired if its at fault) or if there is any aftermarket ones or donor ones that are compatible?


I’m going to get my multi-meter out at the weekend and check all the wires in the loom for continuity and im praying that I find a crappy wire somewhere.

My friend has suggested I strip it and sell the parts! I nearly KO’d him and said this is not what we do…we fix things!

Any help/advice/experience you intelligent lot can give me will be appreciated!


Chris

[xtzrick]

Hi Chris


You could be right about the air valve so worth a check once you get the tank off, or it could be your loose/dirty connection.

From memory the loom earths to the battery via the thick engine earth strap (bullet connecter on the black wire above the battery) everything else either earths to the frame through it's mounting bolt or a wire connected to it's mounting bolt & the frame earths to the engine through it's mounting bolts.

Things to check:
Fuse. I've had them seem ok with the multimeter but not flow enough electricity to do the job, try a spare if you have 1.
The red wire connecters for the fuse & black earth wire connecter above the battery,
Ignition switch. The connecter block is amongst the blocks on the left side of the frame near the headstock, red wire should show battery voltage to the switch, brown should show battery voltage when the switch is on.
Engine earth strap. There might be corossion where it bolts to the engine.

Have you checked your stator with your multimeter?

Rick

[LpoolXTZ660]

Hiya Rick and thanks for the welcome!

I was hoping that you might read my thread as most of the problems ive had on the bike so far have been sorted due to your posts! Enough ass kissing for now!

Where exactly is the air valve once the tank is removed will it be obvious that it is crap from looking at it? (sorry for being an amateur but I have never seen one before although thanks to this forum I know what it does!)

On the topic of fuses would it be worth while (possible) to add a fuse box with more updated fuses or is that stupid? I know that the loom is very outdated.

I am finishing early in work today so I can get home a strip the bike down. I haven’t had the multi meter on the Stator as of yet, I have only guessed this from testing the battery while under load and (reving the ass out the beast) I assumed it was faulty as the battery continued to drain under load.

Once all the panels and tank are off I will probably take a look at the condition of the stator visually.

Would a faulty stator stop all power to the bikes lights, horn and ignition? Im confused as it was fine one minute (all lights and horn working) and literally turned the bike off and on again and it wouldn’t have it. Some bugga’s attempted to rob the bike about two months ago and amazingly it was found with only fairing and ignition barrel damage. The barrel was no problem to get hold of but im having to put up with fairings that look crappy! Could this of been the start of my woes? I don’t think so as I have had it running alright since it was replaced.

I ‘think’ that the battery is good as it’s only a month old, I have trickle charged it overnight and it is holding its charge, please correct me if im wrong but does that not mean the battery is good? Even when I test it now it has enough to be able to start the bike well over 12V.

Just to add has anyone replaced the standard loom connection with something more…modern (water tight)

Many thanks

Chris

[xtzrick]

The air valve is on the left side of the carb, to the right of the tickover screw as you look at it. Undo the 2 screws, pull the cover off & check the rubber diaphram for cracks or holes.
Check the hose that connects the valve to the right side carb for cracks while your at it.

I wouldn't fit a fuse box, it's only 1 fuse.
I do like the look of these though

Google "inline spade fuse holder"
Or you could just seal the holder you have with silicon grease. I'm a big fan of the stuff, it repells water, stays tacky so doesn't peel like silicon sealant & you can still take the holder apart but don't get it on the metal parts of the fuse, it does not conduct electricity
Use it on the rest of your loom, youtube has afew vids on how & were to use it

A faulty stator is unlikely to stop lights & horn from working, more likely to be the power or earth wires mentioned before.
To check the stator unplug it's connecter & measure the resistance between the 3 white wires (3 measurements) each should be between 0.2 & 0.3 ohms.
Then turn your multimeter on to it's highest resistance setting & check for connectivity between each wire & the engine casing (a clean part with no paint or a screw) You should get no reading, no connection.

Rick

[steveloomis]

I like this type of fuse holder. Weather tight too...

[LpoolXTZ660]

Thanks for the tips Rick!

For those that are interested I thought I would do a lil update. I got investigating the electrics yesterday with 2 of the lads.

After looking at the fuse we decided to just bridge it as it was hanging on by a thread and we had no solder (I will be getting it replaced with what you suggested Rick. My mate also suspected a dodgy ground but without a wiring diagram it was gonna be tough.

To see if it was he added a spare bit of wire (didn't know ya could do this) to one of the plugs behind the headlight and tested it by touching the other end to a safe ground (the ignition barrel). My electrics were back headlight horn and indicators. We made this more permanent by attaching it to the negative on the battery. The tank went back on and the fuel line re connected. Went to start the bike and it was cranking but not catching (had a good spark) eventually it stated but as quickly as I could rev it, it died on me. (No poping, just like I’d hit the kill switch) cdi tested ok.

Stator is not charging but would this cause the bike to cut out or could my problem be worse than I thought?

Im thinking of just replacing it anyway but don’t really wanna throw money out if its not going to fix the issue.

I was thinking could be weak ignition? Ain’t got a clue of how to check that.

So for now the cover is back on till next weekend (bloody work!)

Cheers

[xtzrick]

I think your starting problem is caused by an air lock between the fuel pump & carb, these bikes never start easily if they've been stud for a few days
Try tapping the float bowl & hose with a spanner before you try to start it next time or make a dummy tank out of an old washing up liquid bottle & connect it directly to the carb.
Choke on full, NO THROTTLE & press the starter.

The only difference between the 3YF & 4MY wiring is an extra set of wires for the headlight & an extra wire from the ignition unit that goes to the tacho.

Rick

[xtrider]

You must replace that stator if the battery isn't being charged up. Getting good ground throughout the bike is needed first of course to make sure that isn't whats causing the battery to drain but it shouldn't effect the stator output to the battery. If it isn't working though it needs to be replaced or you'll always have low voltage issues and ded batteries. Once the voltage drops to a certain point the cdi will cut spark and shut the bike down. The fuel pump is driven off vacuume I believe so good hoses without cracks or splits is needed. That's probably why these bikes start hard after sitting, the fuel needs to be sucked back up and it takes more cranking of the motor to get the system primed again.

It also sounds like your pilot jet or its passage is partially clogged, that will be why it won't run at idle or cutout when sitting at stoplights. A good carb cleaning may be needed. The cutoff valve is mostly just for deceleration from higher rpms. It doesn't do much at steady throttle or just sitting at idle but will cause some rough running if totally faulty.




.

[yokesman]

Rode a norton 10 years without a battery,day n nite,one kicker. was setup this way from the factory but the the batt died an early death n didnt make much if any difference.

[ActionManMelb]

Rode a norton 10 years without a battery,day n nite,one kicker. was setup this way from the factory but the the batt died an early death n didnt make much if any difference.

Probably had a magneto, which does not require a battery at all.